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Old 08-29-2012, 09:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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why do they almost unilaterally think that water must exist for there to be life?

How dense are human beings to think that alien life must be like us?
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:46 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Water is mandatory for carbon based life to exist since complex chemistry of any sort is incredibly slow in gases and almost non existent in solids. Other solvents have been suggested but none of the alternatives are really credible alternatives to water.
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:06 AM   #3 (permalink)
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You forgot to add "on earth"
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:12 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:32 AM   #5 (permalink)
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why do they almost unilaterally think that water must exist for there to be life?

How dense are human beings to think that alien life must be like us?
I think you're just plain wrong.

Hypothetical types of biochemistry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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Old 08-30-2012, 01:54 AM   #6 (permalink)
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It depends how you define life, I'd say. I actually agree with f3lix on this one.

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Old 08-30-2012, 03:13 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Agree that it's dumb to blindly assume that life must come from water or agree that scientists universally believe this?


The basis of our governments being the opinion of the people, the very first object should be to keep that right; and were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter. But I should mean that every man should receive those papers and be capable of reading them.
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Old 08-30-2012, 03:31 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Agree that it's dumb to blindly assume that life must come from water
this

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Old 08-30-2012, 03:35 AM   #9 (permalink)
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As an aside, I like Richard Dawkins idea that meme's can be considered actual living things. For instance, the story of Sleeping Beauty can be considered a living thing, which reproduces as different people tell it, and even evolves as it changes, and popular changes survive. It "lives" in the medium of "culture" the same way we live in the medium of "physical space" and has a symbiotic relationship with humans the same way flowers do with bees.

You could also easily make the argument that computer programs are already alive despite not being sentient.

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Old 08-30-2012, 04:43 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Buy this book read it and send it to me after to read please
water is special.. many reasons on different levels of structure

BBC - Podcasts - Dr Karl and the Naked Scientist
DrKarl 07 June 12: Tastebuds, Water and Tracking Venus

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Little water bit at around 14 minutes in, asked for confirmation that bbc.co.uk podcast links work in the US, can someone confirm?
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Old 08-30-2012, 04:59 AM   #11 (permalink)
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buy this book read it
water is special there are
so many reasons

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Old 08-30-2012, 06:17 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I think it could be considered equally dumb to assume that life elsewhere isn't like life here on Earth.

Water is also special because it only exists in liquid form under very special circumstances of heat and pressure.
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Old 08-30-2012, 07:53 AM   #13 (permalink)
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^ not unique about water at all, all the elements are special in that sense.
How amazing for water to be liquid at 1 bar and 0c!

Did you know that there are many more states other than solid liquid gas and plasma?
something like 19 structures of ice.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01m0ltw
Here's another good recent podcast episode on the topic of water/life elsewhere.
testing the extremes of earth gives us some idea.

to the original question there's a difference between anthropomorphic and 'like us'
there probably are silicon and other such beings, but as much as we know carbon/water is more likely

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Old 08-30-2012, 08:20 AM   #14 (permalink)
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We should replace "scientists" with band teachers.

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Old 08-30-2012, 08:37 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Yes, but the conditions under which water is a liquid are special because they are considered moderate. They are conditions comfortable for organic life. Sure, there are other objects in space with liquid on them, but the conditions are so rough, that there is no life.

If we view evolution as a universal constant, which it certainly is, then it makes no sense to believe that life anywhere else is all that much different than life here on Earth. There might be slight evolutionary differences, but I'd bet dicks to dollars the end product is quite similar
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Old 08-30-2012, 08:38 AM   #16 (permalink)
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If we view evolution as a universal constant, which it certainly is, then it makes no sense to believe that life anywhere else is all that much different than life here on Earth.
What?

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Old 08-30-2012, 08:46 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Guessing you mean that some form of natural selection will be taking place on another worlds, in that case then yes i'd agree that other life out there will be similar to earth

But natural selection will force things to be suited to whatever they inhabit, at the same time the processes behind how things arise can be similar but lead to very different things.
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Old 09-02-2012, 07:24 PM   #18 (permalink)
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BBC The Search for Life The Drake Equation PDTV x264 AAC - EZTV - TV Torrents Online
Gets off to a slow start but finishes well, there's a little bit on why the water/no water thing isn't a 50/50 split.
Whether our universes biogenesis formed this way, or some other way and waters magic came after, well i'd like to know.
Carl Sagan isn't mentioned until 53:28.
Answers on a postcard for the Fermi Paradox please.
Nope, the BBC don't have an answer for Fermi either
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Old 09-02-2012, 09:59 PM   #19 (permalink)
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What I was saying was this:

In order for life to exist, the environmental conditions must be suitable for organic life. Basically, I'd expect to see another planet like Earth in many ways.

So if we have a planet very much similar to Earth, and we have natural selection occuring on this planet, then I believe the end result would be something almost identical to human beings. Whether or not these other beings are ahead or behind us intellectually would largely depend on how old the intelligent life is. If intelligent life on another planet is 10,000 years older than we are, then I'd expect traveling to their world would be quite similar to traveling 10,000 years into the future on Earth. If the E.T. humans are 1,000 years younger than we are, I'd expect visiting their planet to be similar to traveling back in the time 1,000 years on Earth, with obvious differences in history and culture between the two planets.

It would be very interesting to see how much the different history and culture would affect the progress of the species. Sort of like how the Middle East in many ways is 100 years behind the West in terms of development and progress.

Since the universe is expanding from the point of the big bang, it seems likely that any life-haboring planet that exists further away than us from the singularity would have younger intelligent life on it. Any such planet closer to the singularity would have older intelligent life on it.
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:44 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Old 09-03-2012, 01:43 AM   #21 (permalink)
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In order for life to exist, the environmental conditions must be suitable for organic life.
No.

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So if we have a planet very much similar to Earth, and we have natural selection occuring on this planet, then I believe the end result would be something almost identical to human beings.
What? Why?

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Since the universe is expanding from the point of the big bang, it seems likely that any life-haboring planet that exists further away than us from the singularity would have younger intelligent life on it. Any such planet closer to the singularity would have older intelligent life on it.
I don't think you understand how evolution works.

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Old 09-03-2012, 09:26 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Honestly, I thought we've gone over this kremlin. I don't give a fuck what you think. I don't like you. I think you are a piece of shit. This will be the last time I ever address you. If you want to be wrong, then be wrong. It makes no difference to me. If there even is life on other planets, we will never find it within our lifetimes, so this entire thread is pointless.
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:34 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:44 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Old 09-03-2012, 09:49 AM   #25 (permalink)
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If there even is life on other planets, we will never find it within our lifetimes, so this entire thread is pointless.
This thread is to show what we thought as individuals at this point in time. It's great going back and seeing how dumb or accepting of ignorance we were in previous times.
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