Who Thinks Alcohol Is Gay/Pimp?

[Pliedes]

A leislator once was asked how he felt about whiskey. He replied,
"If, when you say whiskey, you mean the Devil's brew, the poison scourge, the bloody monster that defiles innocence, dethrones reason, creates misery and poverty-yes, literally takes the bread from the mouths of little children; if you mean the drink that topples Christian man and woman from the pinnacle of righteous, gracious living into the bottomless pit of degradation, despair, shame and helplessness, then certainly I am against it with all my power.
But if, when you say whiskey, you mean the oil of conversation, the philosophic wine, the ale that is consumed when good fellows get together, that puts a song in their hearts and the warm glow of contentment in their eyes; if you mean Christmas cheer; if you mean the stimulating drink that puts the spring in an old gentleman's step on a frosty morning; if you meant that drink, the sale of which pours into our treasury untold millions of dollars which are used to provide tender care for our crippled children, our blind, our dear, our dumb, pitiful, aded and infirm, to build highways, hospitals, and schools, then certainly I am in favor of it.
That is my stand, and I will not compromise."

[Titan]

Originally posted by Pliedes:
Titan, I'm not gonna lie to you, and I definitely do prefer the taste of water to that of vodka.

Exactly. And yet even you, a proponent of safe-drinking, has had to have your current bottle of hard liquor hidden from you so that you don't continue to fuck yourself up. Maybe it is the mis-use that is the dangerous part, but perhaps it's the blindness of the users which is more dangerous.

[Pliedes]

And we are all older and wiser nowadays.

I have had times when I lost control, though I can count them on a few fingers and have definitely moved on from those early days of ignorance. I wasn't what you could call a "proponent of safe-drinking" at the time, am I now though? Yes.

I like your second point though.

[ November 21, 2003, 07:11 PM: Message edited by: Pliedes ]

[Ugly Bastard]

Pliedes, it's good to see that you're a proponent of safe drinking now. That makes two of us.

I feel like I have made my points in this thread, those points being that to any teenager, alcohol does more harm than good. You yourself said that you're not going to drink this semester, so you can focus on your grades. So apparantly there is a corelation between alcohol and GPA now too.

To me, it all comes down to one thing: The potential cons of alcohol far outweigh the pros...so I have chosen not to drink (or at least not to drink more than the occasional sip here and there). I have alcholism in my family, and I've seen it's effects on people. If alcohol is hereditary, then I want no part of it.

It's just a personal decision for me.

If you (or anyone else for that matter) want to drink, go right ahead, just don't be too closed-minded that you don't at least weigh the pros and cons of not drinking.

More people have died because they chose to drink alcohol, than people who have died because they chose not to drink alcohol. I like living...so no alcohol for me.

I feel I'm done here, I've said what I've had to say...there ya go.

-Ugly Bastard

[Titan]

It's pointless to try and peg alcohol as "bad". The truth is, whether it can produce good and bad effects or not, it has had and does have a frighteningly (in my opinion) negative effect on our civilization. It doesn't matter if it's our own fault or not, obviously we can't try to "blame" and inanimate object for all the hurt it's caused us. But it's existence in our civilization has had a negative impact that shouldn't be overlooked because it "keeps our blood pressure low".

[ November 21, 2003, 07:23 PM: Message edited by: Titan ]

[Titan]

Originally posted by Ugly Bastard:
More people have died because they chose to drink alcohol, than people who have died because they chose not to drink alcohol.

Haha, wow. Great.
That one actually is going in my quote-book.

[ProfessorNumber]

Alright, I stand by all of my former arguments, but what it boils down to, is that I like alcohol because it gets you drunk. There, I said it. I completely agree with UB that it has more cons than pros. What I don't agree with is all of this conjecture that UB is pulling out of his ass. NO MORE WHAT IF'S.

[Pliedes]

Ugly, nice post, your position was explained much more clearly than in previous posts. I actually said I wasn't going to drink this semester at school. And it's not just alcohol, it's partying in general. A wise friend told me that I should use a semester to understand the academic side of college, then go from there.

Titan, good call.

[Pliedes]

Professor, he finally clarified his position, get off his back.

[Titan]

It's like you always say Pli, if you know you have a problem, then you're half-way to getting over it. So essentially people who know they could fuck themselves up, shouldn't have too tough a time not. I wish that were always the case. As for those who purposely want to fuck themselves up, that's cool, people get fun out of different things; driving fast cars, scuba-diving, jumping out of airplanes, fucking. Whatever. For me, acting like a dumbass and annoying the fuck out of everyone around me and then not remembering my night last night that was supposed to be so socially fun, and then puking all over the place and having a horrid headache and hangover, just isn't my bag.

[ November 21, 2003, 07:31 PM: Message edited by: Titan ]

[Wayne]

More people have died because they chose to drink alcohol, than people who have died because they chose not to drink alcohol. I like living...so no alcohol for me.

The quote still makes sense if you remove "drink alcohol" and instead input:
drive
get their mail
jump out of an airplane
leave their house
etc...

Even though I hate that quote, I agree with you main stance. Just wanted to throw that out there before people started filling their quote books with shit.

[ProfessorNumber]

Originally posted by Pliedes:
Professor, he finally clarified his position, get off his back.

Wrong. He simply stated more truisms and things that could POSSIBLY occur. I respect his opinion; not his conjecture. Given, what he is saying is somewhat logical, but that doesn't mean that all of the bad things that could result from alcohol will in fact happen. He is saying that I COULD get in a wreck, or that I COULD fuck up my life. And you know what? I'm not going to do those things. I don't care what anyone fucking says.

I already agreed with him that Alcohol's negative side outweighs its positive side, what more do you want?

[Titan]

Directed at Wayne's quote.
That's not necessarily true though.
There aren't scientific studies that say it's more likely for you to step outside of your house and getting killed by your neighbor's dog than to stay in there and risk burning alive.
You're probably right about the driving thing though. I fucking hate how dangerous driving is. If I didn't have to drive on busy roads with dumbasses all the time, I wouldn't.

[ November 21, 2003, 07:42 PM: Message edited by: Titan ]

[Niger Angelus]

Without alcohol ugly guys wouldn't get laid.

[Pliedes]

...but they still get laid by ugly girls.

[ November 21, 2003, 10:05 PM: Message edited by: Pliedes ]

[Cocktooth]

Oh but you have to understand that if you drink you can do anything you want...at least this is the philosphy of females...haha im drunk ill fuck that guy..its ok...its the alchool...i mean hey...i wear the beer googles every once in awhile...but you dont see me going around takin care of ever pink taco stand i see when im drunk....the purpose of this post really isnt anything and at this time im intoxicated.....so im sure this is rambling...basically i was just stating the reason most girls drink is for a excuse to be a dirty slut....bye

[StDx]

It's human nature to seek an altered state of conciousness. Alcohol happens to be the easiest and most legal way to achieve this altered state for many people.

Why do you jump out of planes, Ug? Does it make you feel good, do you get a 'buzz' from it? Don't you think that that jumping from such heights poses more possible cons than pros?

Cheers!

[Ugly Bastard]

Stdx-

I know you probably didn't want this big/thorough of a reply, but this is an answer I care passionately about, so you're getting my finest.

You have posed a question I was pretty sure would come eventually: If I'm against drinking alcohol, because it could kill me, then why would I want to jump out of a plane too?

Firstly, let me dawn you with some statistics to brush aside the common stereotypes of skydiving:

One in every 110,000 skydives, the participant dies. That's basically like winning the lottery. Almost all of the people who die from skydiving die because they did something stupid, not because "they're chute didn't open". In order to die because your "chute didn't open", you would have to have something go wrong with your main chute, cutaway to your reserve chute, and have that not open. The odds of a chute just "not opening" altogether are about 1 in 50,000. So you would have to hit 1 in 50,000 two times before you found yourself in a helpless position.

Most people die in skydiving because they do something stupid such as turn too low (if you make any drastic turns under 200 feet, you parachute will spin you into the ground at a very high rate of speed...the people who make these mistakes are hot-heads who are trying to show off). Basically, if you don't do anything dumb, it is nearly impossible to die from skydiving based on pure accident. You probably have a better chance dying while playing basketball because of a heart attack, than you do while skydiving.

____

Now, with all that being said, let me answer your question more from my heart than my mind:

If I were to ever die skydiving, I would consider myself one of the luckiest people alive today. To me, there is no better way to go, than to do it while you were doing something you love. You'll be remembered by it forever.

Let's take a look at how much fun each activity is.

Skydiving:

</font>

• You get the sensation of flying...most people think it's just falling, but in reality, you can travel up to two miles horizonally during a 60 second freefall.</font>
• You get to live before you die. The highlight of some people's lives is sadly something like "watching the Giants win the 1942 pennant" or "marrying my wife". That's great if that's your thing, but I'd rather die being able to say that the highlight of my life was skydiving. When I'm hanging up there under a parachute...it's like I'm closer to heaven, it's hard to explain.</font>
• Your life is never the same after you do something like skydive. Everything you will ever do for the rest of your life will seem like a piece of cake...if you can jump out of a plane, then you can walk up and talk to this girl, etc, etc, etc. It increases your self-confidence by an incredible sum. Elanor Roosevelt once said, "we gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot."</font>

I could go on forever there, but you get the point.
Alcohol:

</font>

• It makes you partially lose control of yourself, and your actions. Which to some, is a nice sensation...I'm a control freak, so it's not a sensation for me.</font>
• It might help you get laid by someone who would not normally have sex with you.</font>
• You might have a really good time at a party, and make a lot of drinking buddies.</font>
• You might wake up the next morning and not remember anything of the "fun" you had the night before.</font>
• You might get arrested for public intoxication, contributing to a minor's intoxication, driving while under the influence of alcohol, or public disturbance.</font>
• You might become dependant on alcohol and lose your job, family, and friends. (I've watched it happen to my uncle).</font>
• You might decide to drive your car in your clouded state, and kill a family of four on their way to church early Sunday morning.</font>
• You might decide to do something that you would not have done if you were sober, then have the regret of your actions to live with.</font>
• You might decide to drive your car in your clouded state, and kill yourself.</font>

To me, comparing with drinking alcohol with skydiving is bogus. If you told me right this second that I will die at the age of 25 while skydiving, I wouldn't flinch a muscle...if it's my time to go, then what better way could I go? If you were to tell me right this second that I will die at the age of 25 because a drunk driver will hit me in a head-on collision...I'd probably cry myself to sleep tonight...that's not how I want to die.
There is a saying, "All people who live, die. But, not all people who die have lived." People who die from alcohol never lived. People who die while skydiving understand the beauty and wonder of this world more than any other group of people. A skydiver once said, "we who fly do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet."

-Ugly Bastard

[StDx]

Originally posted by Ugly Bastard:
People who die from alcohol never lived.
-Ugly Bastard

You may want to rethink what you said right there... it really makes you sound like a self-righteous elitist.

so you completely missed most of my point there... I was trying to point out the fact that you love skydiving because it gives you a rush, if there was no rush of adrenaline there, would you still do it? That rush is an altered state.

People give many reasons for drinking but it basically boils down to acheiving an altered state.

You said that one out of every 100,000 people who skydive die from it. Let's look at the whole number of people who drink compared to those who are problem drinkers or those who die as a direct result of it... what percentage of the american population do you think drinks alcohol? Now, what percentage do you think actually get:
- arrested for PI, contributing, dwi (public disturbance isn't alcohol related, they'll pop you for PI and drop the lesser charge)
- become dependent on it and lose your job, family, and friends.
- kill a family of four on their way to church on Sunday morning or any of the other stuff you stated.

I'm sorry about your uncle, but it's not the alcohol that ruined his life... what made him turn to the bottle in the way he did. He's in the minority of we who choose to imbibe. His chute didn't open, if you will.

Have you ever really drank?
If so, what kind of experience did you have... where were you, how much did you have, were you among friends, etc?

Basically it boils down to doing what gets you off... you like jumping out of planes, I like enjoying a couple cocktails and the company of a young lady... I'm not here to judge.

[ November 22, 2003, 02:09 AM: Message edited by: StDx ]

[Ugly Bastard]

Originally posted by StDx:
Basically it boils down to doing what gets you off... you like jumping out of planes, I like enjoying a couple cocktails and the company of a young lady... I'm not here to judge.

Sounds good, lets just leave it at that.

-Ugly Bastard

To clarify your main question of my comment "people who die from alcohol never have lived", I could've said that about anyone who has never gone skydiving, it was just the inverse of a quote I've heard, "people who die from cancer have never lived...unless they were a skydiver". It wasn't meant to be taken the way it was...that's my fault. Giddy-up.

[StDx]

Fair enough, but you know the Christal and Henndawg will be flowing like water at the shizzo.

[Ugly Bastard]

Originally posted by StDx:
Fair enough, but you know the Christal and Henndawg will be flowing like water at the shizzo.

Hehe...yes, this is true. I'm hoping it'll be enough to get my ugly ass laid.

(That was a joke pliedes....Number...don't start calling me a proponent of alcohol now or coming back with your reverse psycology bullshit). (that too was a joke)...fuck I'm tired.

Goin to bed...see ya guys.

-Ugly Bastard

[the_butcher]

Wow. While I am too lazy to read most of those posts, I scanned a few.

I like alcohol. That's about it. Hate the taste, love the feeling. That's what this thread is about, anyways, whether we like it or not. Correct?

[tonguegina]

Originally posted by Ugly Bastard:
To me, there is no better way to go, than to do it while you were doing something you love.

I just want to be picky here...what if drinking is something that you really love? What if you die of alcohol poisoning? Would you not be dieing while doing something you love?

Originally posted by Ugly Bastard:
Almost all of the people who die from skydiving die because they did something stupid, not because "they're chute didn't open".

So, you're saying that if you aren't stupid about how much you drink and what you do after you've been drinking, then it's ok?

A lot of the stuff you said there can be turned around. Just remember that.

[Titan]

You all can get your death-kicks however you want, whatever tickles your goat. Me, I'm dying in a tornado, and I look forward to it.