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Unread 10-05-2012, 03:17 PM   #1279 (permalink)
Repugnant Abomination
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde View Post
This is incorrect. By very definition, god interacts directly with the natural/physical world --through prayers, miracles, CREATION -- and so the evidence of god's existence falls within the realm of science. Anything that affects reality/nature can be observed and (hopefully) eventually explained by science.
Wrong.

First of all, you're talking about theism. What about a Deist who doesn't believe God interacts with his creation? So it's not by definition. Secondly, if we were talking about a theistic conception of God and he did interact with his creation through miracles, that would be a momentary suspension of the laws of nature, which a God that existed outside of space and time could do, and would not be measurable by science because the circumstances of that miracle wouldn't be there afterwards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde View Post
Which puts your SJG quote (which believers cling to like it's jesus christ's torso) down pretty immediately. I have no idea how half of his colleagues are mistaken -- as I mentioned before, just the human need to believe. Scientists CAN comment on it -- in the most scientific way possible:

Bare minimum, and 'god' can't even provide a scrap.
I think my above reply shows why the Gould quote still applies. To say that he and all of the other biologists, physicists and scientists of various stripes are just flat out wrong is a little arrogant, a misunderstanding, or an oversimplification. If extremely smart people in different fields of science disagree with each other over the implication of these ideas, then I think it's clear the issue isn't nearly as black and white as you like to say it is.

"It is difficult to discuss the beginning of the universe without mentioning the concept of God. My work on the origin of the universe is on the borderline between science and religion, but I try to stay on the scientific side of the border. It is quite possible that God acts in ways that cannot be described by scientific laws."

-Stephen Hawkings
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