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Unread 10-05-2012, 07:58 PM   #1281 (permalink)
Repugnant Abomination
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde View Post
But there is no reason to believe in Deism after having a full understanding of evolutionary biology, physics, and astronomy. I was a Deist once too, before understanding these things.
That's a fair point, but I would like to point out the following, from our friend Hawking in A Brief History of Time

"Even if there is only one possible unified theory (here he's talking about the unification of quantum mechanics with an understanding of gravity), it is just a set of rules and equations. What is it that breathes fire into the equations and makes a universe for them to describe?"

Now obviously science may some day be able to answer that question, but I think it's a very important and profound one to keep in mind, as philosophers, scientists and theologians have because it may point to something outside of nature. Just food for thought.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde View Post
Isn't it the exact same thing to say that for you to say the all the other biologists, physicists and scientists are wrong about atheism? Sorry, but to me, one holds much more weight than the other for people who can separate their emotions from what they believe in.
I'm not saying they're wrong. I'm saying that I don't know, there seems to be more complexity to this issue than I had originally entertained. You're the one who seems convinced the all of these other scientists who don't agree with the scientists you like are wrong. Furthermore, for you to completely disregard all of these other brilliant scientific minds because you simply think they "let their emotions get in the way" is very arrogant. You might be right in some cases, but every single one of them? Really? Where's your proof? Your proof apparently is that they didn't reach the same conclusion as you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde View Post
Have you even read A Brief History of Time? I find it hard to believe you have/are a big fan of Hawking's work, which I most definitely am. It is Hawking, by the way -- not to be a pedant, but I'm sure you'd question my education on a matter if I said "Stephen Jay Goulds" too.

If you haven't read it, I recommend you do (and read a lot of other books on astrophysics and cosmology as well) to get that quote in further context.
I've read parts of it, but not in its entirety, no. However contrary to your belief I am a Hawking fan and I am not deficient in scientific curiosity and knowledge. In fact I own and have read The Universe in a Nutshell



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde View Post
We can play this game all day. My opinion? When ABHOT was written, being a popular public figure, he couldnt' flat out say he was an atheist because it would damage his public image. Same with Carl Sagan, same with Neil DeGrasse Tyson. If you believe in the possibility of a god (which I do, but am waiting for more evidence), but you don't pray to one, believe in one actively, and go to church etc -- you are an atheist whether or not you want the label or not. People who don't eat any meat and don't want a label are still fucking vegetarians, man.
We can play this game all day. That's my point. But you're only seeing one side of the coin so you think there's nothing left to talk about, which is the reason behind our whole disagreement. It's not about God, or miracles, or praying, or Hawking or anything else...It's an epistemological disagreement about the nature of knowledge.

Last edited by Repugnant Abomination; 10-06-2012 at 06:12 PM.
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