Vote Obama: Bite the Hand That Feeds You

[Mr. Blonde]

Originally Posted by Heaven Can Wait

at the end of the day you can't blame anyone at the top to want to keep their status quo

pretty much EXACTLY what it comes down to right here. the rich pulling every excuse possible to justify their action and reasoning. its human nature, but it doesn't make you any less of a douchebag.

[Ugly Bastard]

Blonde,

If a book publisher approaches you and says he wants you to write a book about your travels throughout Australia because he plans on marketing that book to college kids who might want to follow in your footsteps - and the publishers offers you $800,000 to write that book.

Do you think that it's unfair for you to be able to keep that money for writing the book?

[DDTempest]

Originally Posted by Heaven Can Wait

Republicans get rich by fucking other people, there has to
Be a majority that do dirty work, and if you can plow through that shit, then that's all good, the idea that everyone can make big money is bullshit too, for every person making the 250k figure, hundreds (pulling these figures out my ass) get shafted, Its greed that any person believes he can earn that much, at the end of the day you can't blame anyone at the top to want to keep their status quo, but it's pretty sore on the bottom feeders.

This is exactly the heart of the matter. You can't get rich without poor people. There is no absolute equality, this isn't communism. But there is a difference between being at the top making damn sure you stay at the top by any means necessary and being at the top of the pyramid with a concern about its foundation. You can just replace the bottom level of your pyramid as needed, or you can make sure its stable and add additional layers below it, guess which pyramid is going to get taller?

It all boils down to how you want to build your pyramid.

[Repugnant Abomination]

The issue here is you, UB, right or wrong, value something based on the markets value of it. You stress the quality of something, i.e. a CEO's work being quality, as opposed to a construction worker. I'll give you credit in that you acknowledge that the CEO doesn't necessarily work harder, but his work is more valuable. And your reasoning method isn't arbitrary, it's very straight forward actually - you base their worth according to the market. I guess that's basic economics. I can get on board with some things like that. For example, I think a doctor should get paid more than a construction worker because it's harder to do what they do, it requires a lot of schooling, and society desperately needs them. A CEO? We need them, yes, but some of these top guys, who are getting millions, sometimes tens of millions of dollars? They don't deserve it, and they certainly haven't earned it in the same sense that the doctor earns it.

I guess my problem with you is you see everything through the lens of money. You're the kind of guy who seems to think that might makes right.

Tell some guy who has to get a job straight out of high school to help support his family that he's not working "smart". Tell him it's his own fault he's not successful. The cards aren't stacked against him, nope, he's just in the wrong field.

The market, the demand for certain skills, is shit. Making money shouldn't be and isn't the only thing that matters when it comes to deciding what you should do. It's offensive to me that you so under value the arts and humanities because they simply don't bring in a lot of money. Art is what gives a society culture. If we all thought like you did we'd live in a very efficient, ruthless, ugly world. Money is not enduring, it's not, by any stretch, a noble thing to work for. It's things like writing, art, music, things that have so little "value", that make the world beautiful. It's those things that enrich our souls, not just our pocket books.

I guess I just find your view sad. And don't even get me started on this bullshit, live fast, die young, cars money and bitches mentality that you seem to have. Like you're such a cool fucking guy because you've got money, that we're whiny liberal good for nothing pussies because we don't. Maybe it's just your internet persona or something, but you come off a jerk. I'm glad you're Mr. Alpha male, and have loads of cool black friends with hot bodies, and that you rock at a card game, but if you could tone down the attitude it would be nice.

[Repugnant Abomination]

Originally Posted by DDTempest

This is exactly the heart of the matter. You can't get rich without poor people. There is no absolute equality, this isn't communism. But there is a difference between being at the top making damn sure you stay at the top by any means necessary and being at the top of the pyramid with a concern about its foundation.

qft.

The rich exploit the poor.

[BigDongedHoe]

Originally Posted by Repugnant Abomination

Tell some guy who has to get a job straight out of high school to help support his family that he's not working "smart". Tell him it's his own fault he's not successful. The cards aren't stacked against him, nope, he's just in the wrong field.

The aforementioned CEO I talked about in the post previously came exactly out of this mold. His dad was a high school spanish teacher and his mom didn't work. He was married at 19 and didn't take 1 credit hour of schooling. He's made millions of dollars off of nothing but hard ass work. To take his money (which he gives half of it away to charities anyways) is criminal as he's earned every penny. While there are people who definitely have more opportunity than others everyone has some sort of opportunity, it's what you make of it.

I don't mind people who vote for Obama that truly believe in his idealologies. I just get sick of the people that vote for him based off mob mentality. Look at the demographics of young people that voted (roughly 62-38 Obama so far) and tell me that those people truly know what they're voting for. Hell no, half of them fall into the whole hate on bush protest election mentailty, it's bullshit.

[Ugly Bastard]

Originally Posted by Ugly Bastard

Blonde,

If a book publisher approaches you and says he wants you to write a book about your travels throughout Australia because he plans on marketing that book to college kids who might want to follow in your footsteps - and the publishers offers you $800,000 to write that book.

Do you think that it's unfair for you to be able to keep that money for writing the book?

Blonde? You got kinda quiet there.

What about you Repug? Do you think it's okay to get paid a lot if you write an amazing bestselling novel? Should there be a limit on how much you're allowed to make from writing a book? If so, how much?

[Mr. Blonde]

Yeah, i've been playing fallout 3 and watching your precious candidate lose. Sorry for not having my priorities straight.

Originally Posted by Ugly Bastard

Blonde,

If a book publisher approaches you and says he wants you to write a book about your travels throughout Australia because he plans on marketing that book to college kids who might want to follow in your footsteps - and the publishers offers you $800,000 to write that book.

Do you think that it's unfair for you to be able to keep that money for writing the book?

A. Publishers don't write books, they publish them. Nobody offers to write about other peoples stories except authors, and that is usually about shit a lot more interesting than some kid who just graduated college and bummed around Australia while working at a liquor store. More realistically, I would write my own book and a publisher would offer me some type of deal where I would recieve royalty payments throughout the publishing history of my book. Books rarely work like movie scripts, where they are just "bought" off. I think we're getting off the point here onto something I started with my somewhat off-the-wall inventor statement, and I'll take the blame for that being relatively unfounded and I get your point. Moving on.


B. Even if the above situation were to happen, I wouldn't exactly call that being "taken advantage of." Also, this inventor-who-creates-something-great example isn't really what any of us in this argument are really shooting for. That kind of thing happens, but it happens rarely. Lets face it, as repug said, these opportunities, despite what this "American Dream" conservatives are trying to fight to keep says, aren't very prominent in the REAL WORLD. I mean c'mon, the traditional "American Dream" is a marriage, nice house, a car, a 4+ family, a nice career and a decent retirement. Not only is this a relatively unlikely achievement (without significant debt) these days, because of those reasons it's not even really DESIRED anymore. What is the American Dream you guys are fighting for, ruthless capitalism?

C. Obviously i'm not going to fight against capitalism, as I believe its a good system, but not the kind of capitalism Repug described above that you seem to be reflecting. This survival of the fittest is not a healthy mindset for an economy, or society in general. This "fuck off, if you can't make it, its always your fault, be better at life" isn't really exactly how things workd. I think I had more to say but like i said, i'm watching the election and UB is trying to pull the cat got your tongue card. MUST HAVE LEARNED THAT GENIUS MOVE IN POKER LOL.

[Mr. Blonde]

UB, did you not read this?

Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde

I'm sure authors who make over 250k plus get taxed just the same as the rest of them, UB.

[Mr. Blonde]

Originally Posted by BigDongedHoe

The aforementioned CEO I talked about in the post previously came exactly out of this mold. His dad was a high school spanish teacher and his mom didn't work. He was married at 19 and didn't take 1 credit hour of schooling. He's made millions of dollars off of nothing but hard ass work. To take his money (which he gives half of it away to charities anyways) is criminal as he's earned every penny. While there are people who definitely have more opportunity than others everyone has some sort of opportunity, it's what you make of it.

There it is! As predicted...

Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde

Response: No, actually, blahblahblahblahblahblahblah. So you know a CEO who claims he worked hard.

There is always a backstory that goes something like "ACTUALLY HE WAS THROWN IN A DUMPSTER AFTER BEING BORN AND RAISED HIMSELF WORKING IN A SOUP KITCHIN FROM BIRTH AND THEN WORKED 16 JOBS AND GOT INTO COLLEGE BY GETTING TONS OF SCHOLARSHIPS AFTER STUDYING AND NEVER GOING OUT AND THEN GOT INTO BUSINESS AFTER WORKING AT THE SAME JOB FOR 10 YEARS AND MAGICALLY BECAME A CEO."

I hate hearing shit like this.

Originally Posted by BigDongedHoe

I don't mind people who vote for Obama that truly believe in his idealologies. I just get sick of the people that vote for him based off mob mentality. Look at the demographics of young people that voted (roughly 62-38 Obama so far) and tell me that those people truly know what they're voting for. Hell no, half of them fall into the whole hate on bush protest election mentailty, it's bullshit.

Something got young people out to vote? Yeah, what a bunch of assholes. Being "motivated" and wanting "change". What a bunch of socialist, groupthink pricks. Next thing you know we'll have a 2 minute's hate with pictures of Bush and McCain on the TV.

Not like you guys had a real problem with the young people getting out and voting with the VOTE OR DIE campaign 4 years ago when your candidate won.

[Repugnant Abomination]

I'm bathing in the tears of all of you McCain supporters right now, and it feels sooooooooooo good.

[Cocktooth]

Originally Posted by BigDongedHoe

The aforementioned CEO I talked about in the post previously came exactly out of this mold. His dad was a high school spanish teacher and his mom didn't work. He was married at 19 and didn't take 1 credit hour of schooling. He's made millions of dollars off of nothing but hard ass work. To take his money (which he gives half of it away to charities anyways) is criminal as he's earned every penny. While there are people who definitely have more opportunity than others everyone has some sort of opportunity, it's what you make of it.

I don't mind people who vote for Obama that truly believe in his idealologies. I just get sick of the people that vote for him based off mob mentality. Look at the demographics of young people that voted (roughly 62-38 Obama so far) and tell me that those people truly know what they're voting for. Hell no, half of them fall into the whole hate on bush protest election mentailty, it's bullshit.

I spoke with a dentist that said his youngest child is kind of like Obama's policies. His kid takes away money from his weathy dad, only to strive to be something special in life. I will leave this dentist name secret. I'M JUST SAYING!!! Sorry BDH, I had to. I know your in college, but I didn't want to mention that when making my comment!!

[Ugly Bastard]

Originally Posted by Ugly Bastard

What about you Repug? Do you think it's okay to get paid a lot if you write an amazing bestselling novel? Should there be a limit on how much you're allowed to make from writing a book? If so, how much?

Looks like the cat has got your tongue too.

[Repugnant Abomination]

Originally Posted by Repugnant Abomination

The issue here is you, UB, right or wrong, value something based on the markets value of it. You stress the quality of something, i.e. a CEO's work being quality, as opposed to a construction worker. I'll give you credit in that you acknowledge that the CEO doesn't necessarily work harder, but his work is more valuable. And your reasoning method isn't arbitrary, it's very straight forward actually - you base their worth according to the market. I guess that's basic economics. I can get on board with some things like that. For example, I think a doctor should get paid more than a construction worker because it's harder to do what they do, it requires a lot of schooling, and society desperately needs them. A CEO? We need them, yes, but some of these top guys, who are getting millions, sometimes tens of millions of dollars? They don't deserve it, and they certainly haven't earned it in the same sense that the doctor earns it.

I guess my problem with you is you see everything through the lens of money. You're the kind of guy who seems to think that might makes right.

Tell some guy who has to get a job straight out of high school to help support his family that he's not working "smart". Tell him it's his own fault he's not successful. The cards aren't stacked against him, nope, he's just in the wrong field.

The market, the demand for certain skills, is shit. Making money shouldn't be and isn't the only thing that matters when it comes to deciding what you should do. It's offensive to me that you so under value the arts and humanities because they simply don't bring in a lot of money. Art is what gives a society culture. If we all thought like you did we'd live in a very efficient, ruthless, ugly world. Money is not enduring, it's not, by any stretch, a noble thing to work for. It's things like writing, art, music, things that have so little "value", that make the world beautiful. It's those things that enrich our souls, not just our pocket books.

I guess I just find your view sad. And don't even get me started on this bullshit, live fast, die young, cars money and bitches mentality that you seem to have. Like you're such a cool fucking guy because you've got money, that we're whiny liberal good for nothing pussies because we don't. Maybe it's just your internet persona or something, but you come off a jerk. I'm glad you're Mr. Alpha male, and have loads of cool black friends with hot bodies, and that you rock at a card game, but if you could tone down the attitude it would be nice.

Guess the cat got your tongue too.

This is what I'm going to do with all of UB's money Obama is going to give me:

[BigDongedHoe]

Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde

Not like you guys had a real problem with the young people getting out and voting with the VOTE OR DIE campaign 4 years ago when your candidate won.

I don't have a problem with people getting out and voting as long as they're making educated decisions. P.Diddy loves Obama OMGAZAZZZ ME TOO !@#$#!

Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde

There it is! As predicted...
I hate hearing shit like this.

You hate somebody who's worked hard and also shared their wealth (millions) without having to fork it all over to the government? I'm not sure what's to hate about that. There is no exaggeration in that story at all either, it's 100% true and to be honest most CEO's have similar stories. You bitch about CE0's making millions but don't complain about Alex Rodriguez making $170,000.00/per baseball game?

I don't know you personally but from what I've read on here I've hear you bitch and complain about how hard the "real world" is and how you can't find a good job. How hard have you actually worked to find a good job? Moreover since you realize how hard it is not only find a good job but exceed above and beyond expectations, how can you not respect that?

[Ugly Bastard]

I didn't see any questions for me in that post.

Don't be afraid to think about my question. It won't hurt!

If you write a bestselling novel someday, it is fair for you to be paid handsomely for that? If not, what should the limit be on how much you're allowed to make from selling your writing?

[Repugnant Abomination]

I think you should be able to make as much money as you want. That's never been disputed. What's disputed is the tax% people pay. I'm all about taxing the rich.

Also, the Republicans are getting raped all across the board. I think I'm going to get drunk to celebrate.

[Mr. Blonde]

Man, looking at facebook statuses, Republicans are REALLY sore losers. Well, It's not really their fault, as Heaven said...

Originally Posted by Heaven Can Wait

at the end of the day you can't blame anyone at the top to want to keep their status quo.

[Ugly Bastard]

Originally Posted by Repugnant Abomination

I think you should be able to make as much money as you want.... I'm all about taxing the rich.

Do you see how you contradict yourself?

Suppose you make $1M from a book deal. At what percentage is it unreasonable for that money of yours to be taxed? If they take 35%... is that okay? How would you feel if they took 50%? What if they made taxes 80%... would you be okay with paying that? If not... at what level do you think it becomes unreasonable for you to be taxed, and why?

[BigDongedHoe]

Originally Posted by Shaw

I spoke with a dentist that said his youngest child is kind of like Obama's policies. His kid takes away money from his weathy dad, only to strive to be something special in life. I will leave this dentist name secret. I'M JUST SAYING!!! Sorry BDH, I had to. I know your in college, but I didn't want to mention that when making my comment!!

I have 15,000.00 dollars in loans not including this year of schooling, When I graduate I'll be 25,000+ in the hole. Which isn't bad considering what others have had.

I know this guy who lives in apartment and doesn't have a job at the moment nor has he for a few months, but that's okay cause Barrack Obama is coming to pay the bills!!! I'M JUST SAYING!!! Sorry Shaw, I had to. You know I still love you regardless

[Repugnant Abomination]

That's not a contradiction. You can tax them heavily and they'll still be much richer than anyone else.

[Mr. Blonde]

UB, did you not read this?

Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde

I'm sure authors who make over 250k plus get taxed just the same as the rest of them, UB.

NOBODY IS PUTTING A CAP ON WHAT YOU CAN MAKE. AT ALL. YOU ARE PUTTING THAT CAP ON YOURSELF BY BEING GREEDY.

[Repugnant Abomination]

Exactly. Nobody is saying there is a limit to how much you can make. You can heavily tax the rich and they'll still be way richer than the rest of us.

[Ugly Bastard]

Originally Posted by Mr. Blonde

NOBODY IS PUTTING A CAP ON WHAT YOU CAN MAKE. AT ALL. YOU ARE PUTTING THAT CAP ON YOURSELF BY BEING GREEDY.

How am I putting a cap on myself by being greedy? That didn't make sense to me.

[BigDongedHoe]

As a side note according to cnn.com.

Kosciusko County (my county) voted 68%-32% McCain higher than any other county in Indiana. Must be because of all the well educated hard working middle class families here, weird.