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Ugly Bastard · 03-30-2005, 11:18 PM

Orgazmo, I read the article, and it does a great job of trying to get the reader to forget one simple fact: Baby seals are being clubbed over the head for the primary use of using their skin for human clothing.

It just doesn't make sense to me. That's all...

-Ugly Bastard

Ugly Bastard · 03-30-2005, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DJ FC:
Life is ugly, Ugly Bastard.

To me, that's a cop-out made by someone who's too scared to think what life would be like if we took care of the environment around us a little better.

No one's perfect. I'm not. I drive a car that burns premium fuel like it's being paid to do so, I'm eating pasta off of a styrofoam plate right now, and I voted for Bush. But, I realize that the Earth is headed in the wrong direction fast. And someday, maybe not in our lifetime, the people of this Earth are going to have to make some major changes if we want to continue inhabiting this planet.

-Ugly Bastard

[ March 30, 2005, 08:24 PM: Message edited by: Ugly Bastard ]

Saint DH · 03-30-2005, 11:24 PM

If you're using the "if you thinks its bad to kill seals, why do you eat chicken, meat, etc..." arguement, there is one main flaw to that. Those animals have been domesticated. They are raised in farms for the soul purpose of becoming food one day. In other words, their species is guaranteed survival as long as long as they supply a portion of that species towards human food. Seals are wild animals, they are not domesticated, and their species is not guaranteed survival because of these fur coats we use them to produce. If anything, it is striking a heavy blow on the survival of their species.

[ March 30, 2005, 08:25 PM: Message edited by: Dirty Harry ]

03-30-2005, 11:41 PM

I hit on that.

I said that legislation should allow "seal farms" if they felt that the seal population was becomming too scarce.

But as long as people desire fur coats and they aren't harming other people in getting the fur coats, then they should never be denied fur coats. Maybe some day people will all develope a collective mental animal rights atitude, and fur coats will no longer be demanded. If there is no demand, no seals will be killed. Until that point, using a renewable natural resource to fuel economic growth... IM ALL FOR IT.

Edit: Calling my arguments a 'cop out' is the biggest 'cop out' of all. Let me explain.

If this was about deer hunting or fishing for food, you likely would have no problem. The issue has never been raised on nubblies. Granted; I brought up this issue, but I think you know what I'm saying.

But people don't hunt deer or fish for food. They "hunt deer or fish for food" what they are really doing is hunting or fishing for sport. They brag about how big the deer, or how big the fish was. (Catch and release is a different story, yet nevertheless cruel). This is worse than clubbing seals for fur coats. Seals are a natural resource, and their coats provide a luxury that brings out an exchange of income that touches both the economically poor (hunters) and gets money out of the wealthiest of wealthy (purchasers of fur coats).

Fishing and Deer Hunting provides little to society besides consumption of sporting goods (don't get me wrong, these are positive) and personal enjoyment. Seals provide economic benefits.

So why aren't there fucks out there fighting fishing and hunting? 2 reasons.

1. Seals are Cute
Deer are ugly, and quite normal. Fish are smelly and we percieve them as food. Seals, on the other hand, don't get eaten often, but are portrayed as helpless little babies, and the media and liberal ninny-poohs have helped portray a holocaust-like image of seal hunting.

But most importantly

People always try to value what is necessary and unessesary when they have no right to do so.
Letting people do what they want is almost always the best option. What's the issue here? The purchasers of these fur coats are 'elitest' rich fucks who don't give a damn about anything and have no heart. This makes you hate the industry even more. This is related to the anti-cellphone and driving issues (which still linger on and are getting more and more attention once they got started) brought up a few years ago. It wasn't because cell phones were more dangerous than passengers, cd players, or eating. It was because only a few had cell phones, they were the new fangled thing, and imediately labeled as dangerous by the 'elite' hating public.

Now. All in all, I would like to know where you stand on the hunting/fishing issue.

Is killing a seal instantly by clubbing them in the head and providing economic growth and a living for seal hunters really worse than sticking hooks in fish; or shooting deer (who usually don't die instantly) merely for the sport of it?

[ March 30, 2005, 08:55 PM: Message edited by: DJ FC ]

Ugly Bastard · 03-30-2005, 11:54 PM

-Ugly Bastard

sim_flex_x · 03-31-2005, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DJ FC:
Deer are ugly

I think deer are cute, but that's just me

Mr. Blonde · 03-31-2005, 01:02 AM

Great points FC.

03-31-2005, 01:35 AM

Why thank you, Blonde.

Niger Angelus · 03-31-2005, 03:30 AM

All I have to say is, who cares? They are animals, put here at our disposal to do with as we please. And Ugly, seals are Ugly.

Saint DH · 03-31-2005, 06:07 PM

Your points are stupid DJ. I didn't read them all but I noticed you were comparing the seal clubing to deer hunting a fishing. There are two drastic differences between the two.

One, the natural predators of deer (wolves, cyotes) have become extremely scarce in Indiana. Coupled with this, there are much fewer deer hunters nowadays than there used to be. The result is a deer population growing exponentially, and soon will exceed the ecosystem's carrying capacity, resulting in thousands of deer starved to death. Deer hunting today is helping to keep the deer population in check. Which I don't mind because in all honesty, I don't want to hit a fucking deer in the road. Seals still have plenty of natural predators. Humans coming in and killing them probably throws the ecosystem way off balance.

Fishing is also completely different. Main reason: fish can't feel pain. So who gives a fuck if people fish? Not only that, but there are massive ammounts of fish everywhere. They reproduce a shit ton.

StDx · 03-31-2005, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dirty Harry:
Your points are stupid...I didn't read them all

Way to prove your dumbassedness.

Mr. Blonde · 03-31-2005, 06:23 PM

I was wondering why you were critiquing if you hadn't read them as well.

Saint DH · 03-31-2005, 08:02 PM

I didn't read them all because I didn't really have time. The key word there is all. I read some of them. I just noticed he was talking about hunting and fishing, and comparing them to the seal killings. So I thought I give a little explanation why I think they are different.

In closing I'd like to say fuck you Stdx. You're a huge faggot. I'd like to see you get hit with a spiked club someday.

03-31-2005, 09:51 PM

If you'd read my arguments, unlike a dumbass who interjects and runs his mouth, then you would realize that I was talking about hunting and fishing for sport, not hunting to keep populations down (which has only recently, and rarely become the 'excuse' for hunting).

StDx · 03-31-2005, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dirty Harry:

In closing I'd like to say fuck you Stdx. You're a huge faggot. I'd like to see you get hit with a spiked club someday.

Dirty, just because I was first to point out your lack of aplomb, doesn't mean that I was the only one to note it. Perhaps you should take the time to read some of the other posts after mine. I always think it's funny when someone of your caliber tries to join an actual conversation regarding something other than hitting people with spiked clubs, fucking someone's mother (I figured that's where you'd go next), or questioning someone else's sexuality. Why don't you go back to the shit talking forum where you belong, the grown ups are talking.

Saint DH · 04-01-2005, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by StDx:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Dirty Harry:
Your points are stupid...I didn't read them all

Way to prove your dumbassedness.[/quote]
Yeah Stdx, look who's talking. I mean, just by looking at the above post, I can see how much you have contributed to this thread. Thanks alot man, we always appreciate stuff like that. Grown ups are talking? Give me a break.

Niger Angelus · 04-01-2005, 04:47 AM

I feel a scrap.
Why do you are Dirty? They are just seals, I am sure there are guidelines that must be followed to insure existence. I mean, what swayed you?

StDx · 04-01-2005, 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dirty Harry:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by StDx:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Dirty Harry:
Your points are stupid...I didn't read them all

Way to prove your dumbassedness.[/quote]
Yeah Stdx, look who's talking. I mean, just by looking at the above post, I can see how much you have contributed to this thread. Thanks alot man, we always appreciate stuff like that. Grown ups are talking? Give me a break.[/quote]
did you read that whole post, dirty?
good work, lil fella.

03-30-2005, 11:41 PM	#29 (permalink)
DJ FC Guest Posts: n/a	I hit on that. I said that legislation should allow "seal farms" if they felt that the seal population was becomming too scarce. But as long as people desire fur coats and they aren't harming other people in getting the fur coats, then they should never be denied fur coats. Maybe some day people will all develope a collective mental animal rights atitude, and fur coats will no longer be demanded. If there is no demand, no seals will be killed. Until that point, using a renewable natural resource to fuel economic growth... IM ALL FOR IT. Edit: Calling my arguments a 'cop out' is the biggest 'cop out' of all. Let me explain. If this was about deer hunting or fishing for food, you likely would have no problem. The issue has never been raised on nubblies. Granted; I brought up this issue, but I think you know what I'm saying. But people don't hunt deer or fish for food. They "hunt deer or fish for food" what they are really doing is hunting or fishing for sport. They brag about how big the deer, or how big the fish was. (Catch and release is a different story, yet nevertheless cruel). This is worse than clubbing seals for fur coats. Seals are a natural resource, and their coats provide a luxury that brings out an exchange of income that touches both the economically poor (hunters) and gets money out of the wealthiest of wealthy (purchasers of fur coats). Fishing and Deer Hunting provides little to society besides consumption of sporting goods (don't get me wrong, these are positive) and personal enjoyment. Seals provide economic benefits. So why aren't there fucks out there fighting fishing and hunting? 2 reasons. 1. Seals are Cute Deer are ugly, and quite normal. Fish are smelly and we percieve them as food. Seals, on the other hand, don't get eaten often, but are portrayed as helpless little babies, and the media and liberal ninny-poohs have helped portray a holocaust-like image of seal hunting. But most importantly People always try to value what is necessary and unessesary when they have no right to do so. Letting people do what they want is almost always the best option. What's the issue here? The purchasers of these fur coats are 'elitest' rich fucks who don't give a damn about anything and have no heart. This makes you hate the industry even more. This is related to the anti-cellphone and driving issues (which still linger on and are getting more and more attention once they got started) brought up a few years ago. It wasn't because cell phones were more dangerous than passengers, cd players, or eating. It was because only a few had cell phones, they were the new fangled thing, and imediately labeled as dangerous by the 'elite' hating public. Now. All in all, I would like to know where you stand on the hunting/fishing issue. Is killing a seal instantly by clubbing them in the head and providing economic growth and a living for seal hunters really worse than sticking hooks in fish; or shooting deer (who usually don't die instantly) merely for the sport of it? [ March 30, 2005, 08:55 PM: Message edited by: DJ FC ]
DJ FC Guest Posts: n/a

03-31-2005, 01:02 AM	#32 (permalink)
Mr. Blonde Spice Master Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 17,969 Internets: 278288	Great points FC.
	Psychedelics are illegal not because a loving government is concerned that you may jump out of a third story window. Psychedelics are illegal because they dissolve opinion structures and culturally laid down models of behavior and information processing. ― Terence McKenna

03-31-2005, 01:35 AM	#33 (permalink)
DJ FC Guest Posts: n/a	Why thank you, Blonde.
DJ FC Guest Posts: n/a

03-31-2005, 03:30 AM	#34 (permalink)
Niger Angelus We still believe. Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Indiana Posts: 4,697 Internets: 216	All I have to say is, who cares? They are animals, put here at our disposal to do with as we please. And Ugly, seals are Ugly.
	I enjoy knives and fire.

03-31-2005, 06:23 PM	#37 (permalink)
Mr. Blonde Spice Master Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 17,969 Internets: 278288	I was wondering why you were critiquing if you hadn't read them as well.
	Psychedelics are illegal not because a loving government is concerned that you may jump out of a third story window. Psychedelics are illegal because they dissolve opinion structures and culturally laid down models of behavior and information processing. ― Terence McKenna

03-30-2005, 11:18 PM	#26 (permalink)
Ugly Bastard Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 13,643 Internets: 247330	Orgazmo, I read the article, and it does a great job of trying to get the reader to forget one simple fact: Baby seals are being clubbed over the head for the primary use of using their skin for human clothing. It just doesn't make sense to me. That's all... -Ugly Bastard

03-30-2005, 11:24 PM	#28 (permalink)
Saint DH Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 6,142 Internets: 284753	If you're using the "if you thinks its bad to kill seals, why do you eat chicken, meat, etc..." arguement, there is one main flaw to that. Those animals have been domesticated. They are raised in farms for the soul purpose of becoming food one day. In other words, their species is guaranteed survival as long as long as they supply a portion of that species towards human food. Seals are wild animals, they are not domesticated, and their species is not guaranteed survival because of these fur coats we use them to produce. If anything, it is striking a heavy blow on the survival of their species. [ March 30, 2005, 08:25 PM: Message edited by: Dirty Harry ]

03-30-2005, 11:54 PM	#30 (permalink)
Ugly Bastard Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 13,643 Internets: 247330	-Ugly Bastard

03-31-2005, 06:07 PM	#35 (permalink)
Saint DH Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 6,142 Internets: 284753	Your points are stupid DJ. I didn't read them all but I noticed you were comparing the seal clubing to deer hunting a fishing. There are two drastic differences between the two. One, the natural predators of deer (wolves, cyotes) have become extremely scarce in Indiana. Coupled with this, there are much fewer deer hunters nowadays than there used to be. The result is a deer population growing exponentially, and soon will exceed the ecosystem's carrying capacity, resulting in thousands of deer starved to death. Deer hunting today is helping to keep the deer population in check. Which I don't mind because in all honesty, I don't want to hit a fucking deer in the road. Seals still have plenty of natural predators. Humans coming in and killing them probably throws the ecosystem way off balance. Fishing is also completely different. Main reason: fish can't feel pain. So who gives a fuck if people fish? Not only that, but there are massive ammounts of fish everywhere. They reproduce a shit ton.

03-31-2005, 08:02 PM	#38 (permalink)
Saint DH Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 6,142 Internets: 284753	I didn't read them all because I didn't really have time. The key word there is all. I read some of them. I just noticed he was talking about hunting and fishing, and comparing them to the seal killings. So I thought I give a little explanation why I think they are different. In closing I'd like to say fuck you Stdx. You're a huge faggot. I'd like to see you get hit with a spiked club someday.

03-31-2005, 09:51 PM	#39 (permalink)
DJ FC Guest Posts: n/a	If you'd read my arguments, unlike a dumbass who interjects and runs his mouth, then you would realize that I was talking about hunting and fishing for sport, not hunting to keep populations down (which has only recently, and rarely become the 'excuse' for hunting).
DJ FC Guest Posts: n/a

04-01-2005, 04:47 AM	#42 (permalink)
Niger Angelus We still believe. Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Indiana Posts: 4,697 Internets: 216	I feel a scrap. Why do you are Dirty? They are just seals, I am sure there are guidelines that must be followed to insure existence. I mean, what swayed you?
	I enjoy knives and fire.